Welcome to the blog for Prof. John Talbird's English 251 class. The purpose of this site is two-fold: 1) to continue the conversations we start in class (or to start conversations before we get to class) and 2) to practice our writing/reading on a weekly basis in an informal forum.
For its lyrics, I felt some similarities between Dylan's and a poem by Langston Hughes- Theme for English B, which I studied in ENGL 102 this summer. Hughes wrote this poem in 1949, much before Dylan released "Ballad of a Thin Man". Theme for English B is written about defiance by black young student toward white professor in NYC. The theme of this poem is more overt than Dylan's song but Dylan seems showing his defiance toward somebody who has succeeded socially and economically.
Hearing "Ballad of a thin man" by Bob Dylan, the verses from the beginning seems like the character of Mr Jones walks in on his wife or girlfriend with another guy. the visual of his significant other with another man drives Mr. Jones to point of insanity. In later verses the visuals describes the heartache and craziness feeling someone on drugs and hurting inside.
The first nine lines remind me of a time when I see something crazy and I have no idea how I am going to explain that to my mom at home, with out her freaking out. To me the song may be talking about situations you come into that you don't totally understand and don't know how to explain it.
Not only in the lyrics, but in the performance of the song there seems to be a dissatisfaction with popular journalism. With Bob Dylan's status, it's understandable why he is annoyed. When there's a spot light on you, and your art is being examined, there tends to be a "you don't understand what I'm saying attitude." There's a defensiveness that comes into play. This is when Dylan begins to flip the script and start to poke and prod at journalists. In popular journalism, writers tend to try and condense art to apply to common minds, when in actuality minds need to mend to art. This is why Dylan sings "Because something is happening here / But ya' don't know what it is / Do you, Mr. Jones." It seems as if he's pointing a finger to these journalists and telling them that they don't have the slightest clue as to what's going on in the world, or what Dylan's art means and represents. He also seems to be criticizing those who are "well-read." There seems to be a misunderstanding where those that are "well-read" can also be described as intelligent. There is a big difference between those who think freely versus those who have adapted to the education system, and think how the system has taught them to think. The lines "You've been through all of F. Scott Fitzgerald's books / You are very well read / It's well known" has the same dissatisfaction tone which is why I believe he is calling out these "well-read" journalists.
As many of us said in class the song was a bit confusing. It's nothing compared to what we listen to now. Songs we listen to now usually have a meaning that we grab to fast. The understanding of the lyrics are fast to grasp on. It seemed like he was free writing about something that bothered him and turned it into a song. When I saw a clip of the song in the movie and what they tried to interpret of it made a bit more sense to me. It seemed like he was talking about a man who is involved in a society he can't relate to. And is trying to understand the changes around him.
This is poetry, without a beat or a rhyme. Each sentence has its own meaning. It is a bit confusing. Bob Dylan appears to be on drugs at the time composes this song.
I think Mr. Jones is a symbol of everyone that doesn't understand Bob Dylan. Mr. Jones doesn't belong in the crowd, everyone else seem to be enjoying themselves by smoking and finding humor is idiotic things, while Mr. Jones is confused, Like how can anyone find any of this stuff funny or normal. Mr. Jones think these people are nuts.
I agree with you Rhonda. Yet, I'd like to add that it is not specifically Mr. Jones that doesn't understand Bob Dylan and his crew, it's the wider audience who dislike him for what he represented which was fun and open-mindedness
Overall, Ballad of a Thin Man seems to be about the reversal of roles. Someone who has "been with the professors" and is "very well read" is now the one who is feeling out of place. Ironically, he is surrounded by people that would normally be called the freaks. Mr. Jones seems to be desperately trying to fit in and understand what these people are about-- but in this scenario, he is the black sheep.
When I first hear this song it reminded me of the times I traveled to another country, I would feel lost just like Mr Jones did. It also reminded me of how society changes so much and a lot of old school people don't agree with today's society.
In verse 4, "But nobody has any respect.....charity organization" it might refer to the fact that the writer is living in a society where people don't care about each other. One might seem capable of doing something outwardly whereas in reality he or she is unable to do that specific task. For example: a woman is two month pregnant who is sitting on a bus and there is an older lady standing in front of her. Other people start judging the pregnant woman because she is not offering the old lady the seat and she doesn't look sick. The pregnant woman might be feeling dizzy that's why she is trying to sit.
You are so right people seems to be heartless in our society today. I saw a pregnant woman running for the bus, she was knocking on the side of the bus but the driver did not open the door. Ballad of a thin man is some what confusing to me.
While listening and reading the lyrics to the song,Ballad of a Thin Man, by Bob Dylan, I felt a lot of the character's emotions. Confusion, devastation, fear, and empowerment. I see Mr. Jones as being forcedly rewritten. Struggling. He's speaking aloud in a room, questioning his new perfection as a new script awaits his departure from isolation.
He's afraid of how his peers will view him. He doesn't want to change his identity. New visions tried to capture him, but that didn't work, so the mirror exposed him. That caught his attention. He sees himself in a vulnerable state. Naked.
He completes his visions. He now stands out of the box. He has drifted away from society's views, but he is outcasted and still trapped. Now he walks with the misunderstood. The minorities. Ironic.
I compared parts of the Ballad to a first day of class. Preparing for what is to come, wanting to be certain you'll be accepted by peers. It's all new, but you strive to reach goals expected of you.
This is the first time I've listen to a song like this . This is very different from the music I listen to but that's a generation gap . He always end each big lyrical line with " But you don't know what it is Do you , mister Jones " . From the song I feel like I'm living life but there's so much things that I don't know the answer to and the many issues that's going around in the word . For me to become my own person I have to live life for myself , because life is a learning experience . Then bob in the poem start presenting social issues like immigration, finance, being judge . This poem all together is a way to enlighten people . By that I mean to make people have an open eyes of th stuff that's going around them , while staying true to themselves . By staying true to yourself , you're finding all the answers to those issues by yourself . Everyone create their own subjective view to the world and not objective . But I also have another idea to the meaning of " Do you Mister Jones " . It's like what I said you don't need to ask other people around you for the answer because their just as lost as you are . For example, the cell is the most basic unit of life . You could agree on it because it's been proven but who said you can't go against it ? Don't just agree on something because someone Else is telling you . Have your own mind and find your own resolution .
I think the theme of the song is "it's hard to accept change for human naturally". The writer mentions the journalist here who was having hard time to cope up with the changing style of Dylan's singing career.
For its lyrics, I felt some similarities between Dylan's and a poem by Langston Hughes- Theme for English B, which I studied in ENGL 102 this summer. Hughes wrote this poem in 1949, much before Dylan released "Ballad of a Thin Man". Theme for English B is written about defiance by black young student toward white professor in NYC. The theme of this poem is more overt than Dylan's song but Dylan seems showing his defiance toward somebody who has succeeded socially and economically.
ReplyDeleteThat's a great poem, Koichiro. For those of you who haven't read it, you can here: https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/47880/theme-for-english-b
ReplyDeleteHearing "Ballad of a thin man" by Bob Dylan, the verses from the beginning seems like the character of Mr Jones walks in on his wife or girlfriend with another guy. the visual of his significant other with another man drives Mr. Jones to point of insanity. In later verses the visuals describes the heartache and craziness feeling someone on drugs and hurting inside.
ReplyDeleteWell the songs first 2 verses remind me of like the first day of school and how someone may feel about feeling alone because you don't know anyone.
ReplyDeleteThe first nine lines remind me of a time when I see something crazy and I have no idea how I am going to explain that to my mom at home, with out her freaking out. To me the song may be talking about situations you come into that you don't totally understand and don't know how to explain it.
ReplyDeleteI think mr. jones is a reference to himself and how hes battling his inner emotions.
ReplyDeleteNot only in the lyrics, but in the performance of the song there seems to be a dissatisfaction with popular journalism. With Bob Dylan's status, it's understandable why he is annoyed. When there's a spot light on you, and your art is being examined, there tends to be a "you don't understand what I'm saying attitude." There's a defensiveness that comes into play. This is when Dylan begins to flip the script and start to poke and prod at journalists. In popular journalism, writers tend to try and condense art to apply to common minds, when in actuality minds need to mend to art. This is why Dylan sings "Because something is happening here / But ya' don't know what it is / Do you, Mr. Jones." It seems as if he's pointing a finger to these journalists and telling them that they don't have the slightest clue as to what's going on in the world, or what Dylan's art means and represents.
ReplyDeleteHe also seems to be criticizing those who are "well-read." There seems to be a misunderstanding where those that are "well-read" can also be described as intelligent. There is a big difference between those who think freely versus those who have adapted to the education system, and think how the system has taught them to think. The lines "You've been through all of
F. Scott Fitzgerald's books / You are very well read / It's well known" has the same dissatisfaction tone which is why I believe he is calling out these "well-read" journalists.
As many of us said in class the song was a bit confusing. It's nothing compared to what we listen to now. Songs we listen to now usually have a meaning that we grab to fast. The understanding of the lyrics are fast to grasp on. It seemed like he was free writing about something that bothered him and turned it into a song. When I saw a clip of the song in the movie and what they tried to interpret of it made a bit more sense to me. It seemed like he was talking about a man who is involved in a society he can't relate to. And is trying to understand the changes around him.
ReplyDeleteThis is poetry, without a beat or a rhyme. Each sentence has its own meaning. It is a bit confusing. Bob Dylan appears to be on drugs at the time composes this song.
ReplyDeleteI think Mr. Jones is a symbol of everyone that doesn't understand Bob Dylan. Mr. Jones doesn't belong in the crowd, everyone else seem to be enjoying themselves by smoking and finding humor is idiotic things, while Mr. Jones is confused, Like how can anyone find any of this stuff funny or normal. Mr. Jones think these people are nuts.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you Rhonda. Yet, I'd like to add that it is not specifically Mr. Jones that doesn't understand Bob Dylan and his crew, it's the wider audience who dislike him for what he represented which was fun and open-mindedness
DeleteOverall, Ballad of a Thin Man seems to be about the reversal of roles. Someone who has "been with the professors" and is "very well read" is now the one who is feeling out of place. Ironically, he is surrounded by people that would normally be called the freaks. Mr. Jones seems to be desperately trying to fit in and understand what these people are about-- but in this scenario, he is the black sheep.
ReplyDeleteWhen I first hear this song it reminded me of the times I traveled to another country, I would feel lost just like Mr Jones did. It also reminded me of how society changes so much and a lot of old school people don't agree with today's society.
ReplyDeleteIn verse 4, "But nobody has any respect.....charity organization" it might refer to the fact that the writer is living in a society where people don't care about each other. One might seem capable of doing something outwardly whereas in reality he or she is unable to do that specific task. For example: a woman is two month pregnant who is sitting on a bus and there is an older lady standing in front of her. Other people start judging the pregnant woman because she is not offering the old lady the seat and she doesn't look sick. The pregnant woman might be feeling dizzy that's why she is trying to sit.
ReplyDeleteYou are so right people seems to be heartless in our society today. I saw a pregnant woman running for the bus, she was knocking on the side of the bus but the driver did not open the door.
ReplyDeleteBallad of a thin man is some what confusing to me.
While listening and reading the lyrics to the song,Ballad of a Thin Man, by Bob Dylan, I felt a lot of the character's emotions. Confusion, devastation, fear, and empowerment. I see Mr. Jones as being forcedly rewritten. Struggling. He's speaking aloud in a room, questioning his new perfection as a new script awaits his departure from isolation.
ReplyDeleteHe's afraid of how his peers will view him. He doesn't want to change his identity. New visions tried to capture him, but that didn't work, so the mirror exposed him. That caught his attention. He sees himself in a vulnerable state. Naked.
He completes his visions. He now stands out of the box. He has drifted away from society's views, but he is outcasted and still trapped. Now he walks with the misunderstood. The minorities. Ironic.
I compared parts of the Ballad to a first day of class. Preparing for what is to come, wanting to be certain you'll be accepted by peers. It's all new, but you strive to reach goals expected of you.
ReplyDeleteThis is the first time I've listen to a song like this . This is very different from the music I listen to but that's a generation gap . He always end each big lyrical line with " But you don't know what it is Do you , mister Jones " . From the song I feel like I'm living life but there's so much things that I don't know the answer to and the many issues that's going around in the word . For me to become my own person I have to live life for myself , because life is a learning experience . Then bob in the poem start presenting social issues like immigration, finance, being judge . This poem all together is a way to enlighten people . By that I mean to make people have an open eyes of th stuff that's going around them , while staying true to themselves . By staying true to yourself , you're finding all the answers to those issues by yourself . Everyone create their own subjective view to the world and not objective . But I also have another idea to the meaning of " Do you Mister Jones " . It's like what I said you don't need to ask other people around you for the answer because their just as lost as you are . For example, the cell is the most basic unit of life . You could agree on it because it's been proven but who said you can't go against it ? Don't just agree on something because someone Else is telling you . Have your own mind and find your own resolution .
ReplyDeleteI think the theme of the song is "it's hard to accept change for human naturally". The writer mentions the journalist here who was having hard time to cope up with the changing style of Dylan's singing career.
ReplyDelete